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2 hours ago, patason said:

visokotonci bljuju vatru 

čini ti se , prešlo je preko Samsung mobilnog i raznoraznih obrada dok ga pogledaš na YT

Što se tiče visokih, zvuk nije zatvoren, na protiv ali nije ni naporan ni oštar.  

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Baš udarila vrućina ovih dana...

Pitanje ti je "spot on" i moram da nadjem link ka clanku koji daje skoro pa u potpunosti odgovorna na njega... Sustinski ja cenim da Dirac nece od Funai linije napraviti Accuphase zvuk (brendovi

Tozo imam sve i jedan kabl promenjen u odnosu na original naim i linn kablove.Dakle uopste se ne branim od promena kablova, molim te ne podmeci.Udaviste kablovima i gde treba i gde ne treba.Kod Laleta

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IMG_20201205_175021.thumb.jpg.d9ce20a30aad48cbaaa1e9ee4600e5b6.jpgNije kibernetika uraditi adapter od "lončastog podnožja" na octal. Verovatno ni u lokalu. Ne uzimati kineska"lonac podnožja" iz nove produkcije jer su loša, ne pitaj kako znam nego NOS. Ako vas zanima, uzimajte kod Jan Wuestens-a. Kod EL51 već je interno vezana katoda na g3 dok kod el50 nije

Ako već nije urađeno, ne vidim jasno na slici.

IMG_20201205_174927.jpg

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@golum @lalelalaMislim da je ovo prava cev.

F2a Ili F2a11 (razlicita podnozja...)

ultra-long-life, mislim da je izradjivao samo Siemens, koristila se u instrumentima za medicinu i na drugim mestima gde oprema mora biti pouzdana... Imao sam prilike da se upoznam sa ovom cevi. Izuzetna izrada stvarno. Ali slusao sam je samo u pojacavacu snage gde je radila kao izlazna cev u triodnom spoju. Veoma je linearna a zvuk je stvarno bio dobar... Vidim pre izvesnog vremena i Shindo lab ima neke modele sa ovom cevi?

Ne nalazi se bas lako i ima specificno podnozje koje nije jednostavno naci. Ali to podnozje sa ovom cevi pravi savrsen spoj. Bolje od becine drugih. Nema nikakvog klimanja kao ni pretezanja.

Koliko je cev linearna vidi se grafika anodnih kriva u triodnom spoju. Linearnija je od ovih ostalih koje se spominju.

F2a11 ima isto podnozje, mislim ali nisam siguran 100% da ima i isti pin-out kao i EL156 cev. Ovo podnozje se lakse nalazi ali mislim da je za F2a malo kvalitenije?

ALI pre bilo kakve "rolrelijade" obavezno konsultovati @simplicisius -a.

 

fotke:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Siemens-F2a-Endroehre-Roehren-Verstaerker-Beam-Power-Tetrode-Klangfilm-NIB-NOS-/123368920819

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/4x-f2a11-audio-tubes-siemens-109817822

 

adapter za F2a11, EL156 na klasicni octal (EL34)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1pc-Gold-plated-KL73551-F2a11-instead-KT88-tube-converter-adapter/202184424294?hash=item2f13217b66:g:SSQAAOSwBRVaWHkg

 

 

F2a in triode mode.png

EL156 in triode mode.png

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presudio je onaj 1% u ovom slucaju - NOS lampa(e) merena pre slanja ka meni; ljudi maheri radili u Tesli (stare kuke) - ubacena u podnozje mojim rukama (nisam trapav), transport ka NS; ubodeno u DAC i kanal ne radi - ostalo je Mican prikazao

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Mislim da nije to toliko do podnozja? Taj tip pinova i sastava sa staklom je prema mom nekom iskustvu nekako nepouzdan. Desava se da popusti i lepak izmedju bakelitai stakla. Ova druga podnozja i nacin izvodjenja pinova su po mom misljenju bolja verzija. Ali ono sto je dobro je da je kod tih cevi vacuum odlican i da se cev da popraviti. Ja sam tu koristio neku tecnost koju koriste casovnicari za reparaciju stakla. Kao tecno staklo tako nesto. A vidjao sam i primerke koji su osteceni jer se lepilo "super" lepkovima...

 

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BTW el51 vs el156 - osnova za komparaciju isti DAC kao Lalin:

Telefunken EL156

I bought these Telefunken 156 NOS/NIB here in Switzerland for around 240 bucks a pair. This tube delivers an impressive 50 Watt. Yoda confirmed that they are save to be used in the TRP. 

Once the tubes arrived a few weeks ago I had to be patient and wait another week or two for the adapters to arrive. Once they, did I initially struggled to insert the tube into the adapter. So I pushed down the metal connectors on the adapter to make more room for the pins to enter. Finally, still applying a lot of force, I managed to insert the tube into the adapter and I was ready to burn them in.

They have been in use now for 50-70 hours and haven’t changed much the last 20 hours or so. During the burn-in phase these were volatile: treble was glassy and bass was instable. In the meantime, I have used them with a variety of rectifiers (gz480, taka, acme, usaf 596, rk 5u4g, marconi 5u4g, fivre 5u4g and a few more) and their distinctive character comes through with all of them.

In terms of output tubes I have directly compared them against the PSVanes 6Ca7 and mostly against the Teslas EL51 as these are probably the two tubes which perform best in most systems including mine: the Teslas by the way much more so than the PSVanes. There‘s not even a comparison which I realized again during this test.

So how about the Telefunkens? First thing that you‘ll notice is the extreme power. Thes tubes  are full throttle and produce the most muscular sound I have heard to date from any tube in the TRP by quite a margin. The bass reaches a felt octave lower and punches so hard that you sometimes get a clubbing- or amplified live concert impression. 

Second thing that pops to mind is the extreme presence and focus of how instruments and sounds are portrayed in the room.  Imaging and separation are excellent. This is on the level of the Teslas although the stage is further back in the room. Also, images don‘t have the same 3D body as with the Teslas but they equally grab your attention by their strong attack and presence. The PSVanes in comparison are rather sleepy.

Marco dynamics are phenomenal and the stage is impressive. Especially width. Stage height and depth are less compared to EL51. 

Treble is extended and  clear. Despite the massive bass these tubes feel fairly neutral as they are very extended on the top end too without any midrange bloom. Negatively spoken this neutrality somewhat reminds me of a KT88 (but with way more tension and elements that keep it interesting). If this was a rectifier then it’s closest sibling would probably be the RK 5U4G.

Considering the neutrality, voices are not rendered with this intimacy as the Teslas would do. Also voices are not as holographic. The soundstage is more 2D and mostly behind the speakers. There’s not the same depth and layering as with the Teslas.

Details are excellent. Especially in the bass department plenty of nuances can be picked up. Despite this massive bass, the tube is clean and bass is well separated from mids. Thus plenty of details can be retrieved with this tube. 

The biggest problem I had with it is timbre. I don‘t know whether it has to do with the massive weight and muscle that overshadows things and causes a slightly veiled sound.  In my setup it somehow sounded rounded-off in the midrange. Initially, I did not mind but the longer I listened the more I was missing this organic, direct, open and intimate sound that the Teslas would produce. Switching back to the EL51s confirmed this impression. Timbre is on a different level in my setup.

So where does it leave this tube? Well - unlike many other output tubes I tried - this one is worth writing about. The attack, presence, focus, imaging and macrodynamic are as good as it gets. The sound is alive and grabs your intention: only the Tesla can do that to the same degree. The bass is impressive, reaches deeper than with all other output tubes I tried and has massive impact. If a system lacks muscle/weight, this is definitely the tube to go for. In my system and to my liking it produces slightly too much low end power. I would use this tube for rock and electronic music, playing loud and bringing the live-concert or techno club home. 

Concluding it can be said that it is a really good tube and worth having it in the collection because in certain disciplines it plays champions league. Due to the slightly coated timbre (in my system), the lack of depth and 3D as well as the massive bass (not for me in the long run) it will not displace the EL51.

 

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Kod mene veselo , opet novi eksperimenti ... 

Prisutni Igor(nije član foruma , fura se na Martene Duke II) , @Toza & @Kiza2002

Večeras na gostovanju Devialet Expert 220 Pro

Prvo smo se malo borili da ga Roon nekako vidi ali kad smo usled velikog nestrpljenja odustali od te varijante i iskoristili Auralic Aries Mini (moj najbolje iskorišten hardware ikada ) zabava je počela ...

Dakle slušali smo ovako : Roon - Aries mini - Devialet - Marten Django

Prvo smo slušali Devialet sa njegovim fabričkim naponskim kabelom i mojim novim zvučničkim i sviralo je to  OK ali bez neke velike dinamike, poprilično stegnuto ....zamenili smo fabrički kabel sa mojim najnovijim  naponskim koji smo skinuli sa mog preampa i onda smo dobili iskričav , vrcav i jako dinamičan zvuk  .... zatim smo primenuli SAM profil za moje kutije i oduševili se kako dobro svira bas i bez dodatnih DSP korekcija na Roon-u

Onda smo malo preslušali sve najzahtevnije deonice nabudženih  i malo manje nabudženih produkcija raznoraznih autora i zaključili da je Devialet opaka sprava ....sa svojih 220 Watt-a na 6 Ohm-a lepo on gura Martene koji baš vole da se rasipaju sa strujom ko V8 motor sa benzinom ...

Celokupna prezentacija bi mogla da stane u nekoliko reči, toplija strana neutralnog, dinamično i detaljno ali nikako ne predetaljno i zamorno (što smo nekako očekivali, barem ja)....moglo bi se reći da su Devialet i Marteni jako lepa kombinacija

Da napomenem, sve jako lepo svira i na tihom slušanju ... i ne greje se uopšte tako jako ... u normalnim i malo povišenim uslovima glasnoće sve merne tačke su bile ispod 50 stepeni. 

Da li bi možda trebalo uzeti Devialet Expert 440 pro ? Ne nužno, može se lepo živeti i sa 220 jer zaista jako lepo gura veoma zahtevne kutije, a možda za veselije trenutke zatreba i model sa 440 Watt-a , mada nije sve tu samo u snazi jer jači model ima realno osetno bolji zvuk ...ko kupi 220-ku ne treba da sluša 440-ku i treba da stavi tačku na dalje eksperimente.  

I na kraju, Devialet sigurno nije najbolji zvuk kojij sam čuo, ali je dovoljno dobar da zaboraviš na sve i prepustiš se uživanju u muzici. 

Jako lepo veče, prepuno novih iskustava i zaključaka glede USA sistema za pečalbu ...

Devialet.jpg

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Ne znam sta vas je mucilo kod Roon-a - kod mene je iz cuga sve proradilo.

Jel vam se Devialet uopste "video" na mrezi? Najlaksi nacin za test je Expert Remote App - ako to radi, konektovan je.

Jel ste iskljucili DPM (Dynamic Power Management)? To je po default-u ukljuceno, smanjuje potrosnju i grejanje, ali "gusi" dinamiku.

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Lale,zaista velik broj ampova najrazlicitijih tipova si slusao sa Martenom,Od A,preko ab do d klase,tranzistora,j fetova, lampi,balansiranih i nebalansiranih...od relativno malih do  velikih brojeva u vatima.

Bilo bi lepo napraviti neku retrospektivu uz kratak komentar o svakom zvuku.Znam da ti to umes vrlo sistematicno,moglo bi biti zanimljivo procitati u jednom postu.Onako ukratko,sta je kojem najveca vrlina,mane me manje zanimaju...volim da ostane u pozitivnom duhu,u krajnjem slucaju to su sve bili odlicni ampovi.

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